Corporal punishment survey

The Isle of Man did not ban CP in schools till 1999/2000 it took some time to die out
The Birch was banned earlier I think because of a Judgment or the ECofHR against the IOMan The Island was split 50/50 on this issue

I was spanked at age 8 and above   and slippered from the age of 9 to about 13 in junior and secondary school

The information I’d love you to provide is the following:

About You:
Gender:  Male
Approximate age when punished: NINE
Approximate year of punishment: I think 1985
Crime committed or alleged:  The catch all  Talking in class

About the punishment
Administered by Head, or Staff member: The Head who was also our class teacher at that time
Gender of staff member:  Male
Location punished (Classroom, Office, Hallway etc):  Classroom 
Type of punishment (Cane,Slipper,Paddle etc): SLIPPER  Rubber soled plimsoll
Number of strokes:  THREE he would add one stroke for each boy or girl called out to a max of four which he hardly ever gave
Applied to (Hand, Bottom, Legs etc):   Bottom
Position adopted (Standing, Bending over Chair, Desk etc):  Touching my Toes
State of dress (Over Trousers/Skirt, panties, bare etc): Over Short Trousers
Privacy (In private, In front of Class, With another teacher etc): In Front of Class

About the school  Junior
Name of School:  Albert Road Junior School
Town:
Country:N/A     IoM  part of the old Empire

Effectiveness
Were you ever punished again for the same offence?:  YES 
Do you consider the punishment effective?:  I could take two strokes with no problem like the other kids BUT three made my eyes go damp 

Any other relevant info: If he caned a boy or girl it was mostly two light taps bUT the slipper STUNG
john_smage85@yahoo.com

Many thanks for your participation. I will reply to this post myself with the details of the CP I received.

Hello Another_Lurker,   REF.  * 929 
There has however been much discussion here of birching, particularly the versions employed on the Isle of Man.  Are you of an age please to have any recollections of birching cases or circumstances surrounding them, or indeed any local information on how they were conducted?
This is from my own recollection I can’t guarantee it is a 100% correct with dates etc But as far as I am concerned  its near enough!.
The birch as a punishment for your offenders was banned by order of the European Court of Human Rights 1n 1976.  The Isle of Man had signed up to it!  so under international law The IOM had to obey and impanelment its instruction, The IOM was split down the middle in public opinion . approx 50% though come hell or high-water we should tell the HCOHR to keep out of out affairs, While the other 50% of the population said it should have been banned long ago!  Tynwald of that time obeyed the HCOHR and voted to ban it,  I think the year was 1976.
BIRCHING for punishment of offenders (supposed for series offences)  was done under a court order and they set the number of strokes. BUT a MD  (Doctor) had to issue a certificate that the youth was fit enough to be birched If the Doctor said no then no birching, The MD had to be present while the youth was being birched and could STOP it at anytime.

Youth Court / Children’s Panel.   On the IOM was to bring alleged you offenders to court for “serious offences” I think serious offences is a how long is a piece of string question, But that is my own opinion.   It was for age ranges from Ten to Seventeen BUT most times it would be Twelve to Sixteen They could order a boy to be “caned”  from one to six strokes on the bottom and girls to be slippered again one to six strokes as well or in place other punishments suitable for the child’s age like detention on Saturday with extra school work to do like maths ETC for the younger boys/girls, the older boys or girls might get 500 -1000 lines to write out in detention  For the cane mostly two strokes for age 10-12ish, three strokes for 12 to 13, 14to 15 Four strokes  15-16/17 unto Six of the best, Same for girls with the slipper!. i did know some girls and boys who had been punished that way.

Must close for lunch now but will write on the BIRCH next time
John Smage

As far as I know their were three types of birches

Hello Another Lurker Ref 929  
I far as I know / understand their were three types of birches on the I o M 
1.= For older boys / Youths ages from 16 to 18 or perhaps 19 . it was roughly 4′ (feet  -) long had approx 4/6 birch twigs smoothed down and placed in vinegar bucket to keep it supple. and taped handle,  The youth was meant over table or special board and held down, trousers and undies lowered and lets say six strokes on the bare bottom which most time made the youth cry.
2.= For boys between 14 to 16  it was about 4′ (feet) long about 2″ Diameter  taped handle at one end and tape at the end to hold the twigs together  again he was bent over a table and held down, pants and undies lowered and the number of strokes ordered by the court given mostly about 3/4 strokes on bare bottom again the boy would cry.
3.= For boys between 10 -14  but in reality mostly 12-14 the birch was approx. 3′ 6″ long had 30 smoothed thin birch twigs approx. 2″ Diameter taped handle and a tape wound round the far end .  The boy was bent over the back of a chair ( guess table was too high for boys of that age) pants lowered under lowered The boys parents could watch if they wanted to,  depending the Youth court order 1 to 3 (mostly 2) strokes across his bare bottom that made the boy cry.
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When I was in 4A at A/R school age roughly 11.   Some boys were birched for theft from a shop they aged from 12 to 16, It was in all the papers etc. they were from two schools in Douglas.  We asked Mr. Hislop about the birch?  The next day he brought a type #3 junior birch which he had borrowed from the Police station , We all looked at it lifted it swished it etc. He asked for volunteers to test it!   All the boys not to be seen to be a chicken etc. VOLUNTEERED and lined up about 15 of us boys. I was first in the line by our desks I was called out and told to touch my toes and I obeyed to be honest I was nervous He turned up the end of my blazer raised the birch very high and whipped it down and stopped about 6″ before it hit and gave a light tap with it that did sting/tingle a little, he stand up off you back to your desk Then Next-boy till we all had been birched  at the end he gave a real hard stroke to a cushion which was a real attention getter.

Four girls also volunteered for the birch But Mr Hislop said no its only for boys but he has got the official Y/C slipper a size 12 plimsoll if they want to test it? we thought the girls would back out but they did not!  He said Two strokes at punishment strength but you can change your mind but they did not do so,  The girls lined up and the first one went up to him and touched her toes he turned up the end of her blazer  the first stroke was a light tap but the second was a loud Blam sound and we guessed it stung. Then he said slippering over  next girl  the next three were slippered the same way, Then a Ten year old girl came out and asked could she swop the 100 lines for the slipper  Mr Hislop said yes She touched her toes and he asked her how old she was She said ten Sir He two of the slipper for being a naughty girl He used the size 12 slipper and in a quirt classroom we by the loud whop sound it must have HURT, She gave way to the sting of the slipper and cried on the way back to her desk.

john_smage@yahoo.com

Hello John Smage/Will Penny98,

Thank you for the mass of information you have provided.  I am truly amazed at the prodigious amount of time your junior school teachers, especially Mr Hislop, devoted to discussing and administering corporal punishment, and as late as the mid 1980s.   Back in the 1950s my own junior school had a fair amount of SCP, although there was no caning.  In the past some contributors have thought that I was exaggerating.  I fear that many of them will have doubted your accounts.

Your information on birching also contains some surprises, especially that there was official court ordered JCP for girls, administered with a size 12 slipper, in the Isle of Man.  Further, hitherto most authoritative accounts of I o M birching have placed the last birching there in 1976, whereas you recall it continuing until at least 1987 if I interpret the various dates you have provided correctly.

It is interesting that you have made no effort to conceal the fact that John Smage and Will Penny98 are one and the same person in your posts in this thread, sometimes using both names as originators of a single post.  It is I suppose just possible that there is some complex misunderstanding over the issue.  I fear though that as a result many people will now be very dubious about your motives, and of course the matter has been commented on ‘officially’ in another thread.

Thank you for your kind offer to provide information to me by email.  I fear that people here who have exchanged emails with me in the past will confirm that I am a very unreliable email correspondent.  In addition it is probable that I would not wish to receive information that could not be posted here.

Can I suggest please that if you have a genuine interest in contributing material to this Forum you don’t confuse matters by posting it under two different usernames, especially on the same post!  And if you are posting material claimed as factual which may prove controversial such as your birching revelations it is as well to try to link some sort of corroborative evidence from another source.

I like experimenting with formatting and layout, and so clearly do you.  But some here find that sort of thing an irritation and are happier with unaugmented plain text. It might be best to choose a reasonably consistent formatting style that that suits you and which you can gradually amend  if you wish.

A_L wrote to John Smage:  “I fear that many of them will have doubted your accounts.”

As ever, A_L, you have shown kindness and forbearance that few of us could match.
I’m afraid I am one of those who doubts the accounts of our new correspondent/s, indeed I would say that, from start to finish, they appear completely imaginary.

Hello hcj,

You do me credit that I fear I do not deserve.  Having been shown a great deal of forbearance by people here over my own ventures into fantasy I can scarcely condemn others too roundly for the same transgression.  I trust though that it is quite clear when I am indulging in fantasy, whereas sadly our new contributor has perhaps been a little remiss in that respect.

In addition I have, as old hands like yourself will have spotted, given Mr Smage/Mr Penny98 more than enough rope to hang himself by leading him on just a teeny little bit.  Such tactics are of course frowned on in our judicial system and are a further reason why I do not mount the sort of denunciation in which I would have indulged in the old days.